Discussions

As much as I dislike Justin and certainly did not vote for him... I can understand the need for repairs. Many of you are gawking at the price tag, but being in the construction industry I can tell you that even 10 million isn't going to go THAT far! Repairs can be substantially more than building new, especially when you have no idea what is happening behind the walls. Justin said he would invest in infrastructure and that's what he's doing. The heating, cooling, maintenance costs right now are all also being paid by the tax payer and I'm sure the 'minor' repairs they have been doing over the years would add up to more than the costs to do this massive overhaul.  
 
Think about it like this - the roof is leaking. Re-shingling could cost up to $10,000 on a house that size, maybe more? Well the shingles didn't get done when they needed to be, and now repairs to the structure of the roof and maybe even the attic, ceilings, walls have water damage and mould. Well now you are looking at maybe $50,000+ to have everything inspected, re-engineered, gutted and replaced. This is NOT your average 1,200 sq ft home. It's bigger and the costs will be too. It was not properly maintained over the years and now we (the tax payers) are paying the price. It's too bad that Justin happens to be the one agreeing to move out until it's fixed, but I guess he understands the value of infrastructure. Harper, as a Conservative, did not. A couple bucks in preventative maintenance and infrastructure repairs saved back then turns into $10 million now.

to the dome building on the keystone grounds, aren't those repairs more in line with fixing up old buildings.  
What is going to be the final tally on that building?  
The dome building is a part of history also !

The CBC printed a pretty cool article written with their interview of Maureen McTeer, wife of former PM Joe Clark who's opinion is that 24 Sussex should be torn down and replaced with something Canadians can be proud of.  
 
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/24-sussex-drive-should-be-torn-down-1.3292650  
 
She says the building has little historic significance since the only thing remaining from the original home is a chandelier or something like that and the renovation in the 50's was pretty much all inclusive. However the renovations would be so extensive and for what? To save a building that wasn't even built for the purpose it holds.  
 
The best part of the interview is where she suggests that Canada should involve its top designers and engineers and architects to create something the country can form pride around and that it should be done ahead of the 150th anniversary of Confederation in 2017. I have to say I am in full agreement. This isn't about Justin Trudeau at all, though I believe his family deserves to live in an asbestos free home. This is about creating something worthy of our highest office and the important dealings that could be held there.  
 
And hey, if they abolish the Senate and put the money into the new house, this thing could pay for itself in the next decade.

Mela said "The CBC printed a pretty cool article written with their interview of Maureen McTeer, wife of former PM Joe Clark who's opinion is that 24 Sussex should be torn down and replaced with something Canadians can be proud of.     http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/24-sussex-drive-should-be-torn-down-1.3292650     She says the building has little historic significance since the only thing remaining from the original home is a chandelier or something like that and the renovation in the 50's was pretty much all inclusive. However the renovations would be so extensive and for what? To save a building that wasn't even built for the purpose it holds.     The best part of the interview is where she suggests that Canada should involve its top designers and engineers and architects to create something the country can form pride around and that it should be done ahead of the 150th anniversary of Confederation in 2017. I have to say I am in full agreement. This isn't about Justin Trudeau at all, though I believe his family deserves to live in an asbestos free home. This is about creating something worthy of our highest office and the important dealings that could be held there.     And hey, if they abolish the Senate and put the money into the new house, this thing could pay for itself in the next decade. "

will have the same chance of abolishing the Senate as Stephen Harper did. Zero, zilch, nada!

SJK said "    Mela said "The CBC printed a pretty cool article written with their interview of Maureen McTeer, wife of former PM Joe Clark who's opinion is that 24 Sussex should be torn down and replaced with something Canadians can be proud of.     http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/24-sussex-drive-should-be-torn-down-1.3292650     She says the building has little historic significance since the only thing remaining from the original home is a chandelier or something like that and the renovation in the 50's was pretty much all inclusive. However the renovations would be so extensive and for what? To save a building that wasn't even built for the purpose it holds.     The best part of the interview is where she suggests that Canada should involve its top designers and engineers and architects to create something the country can form pride around and that it should be done ahead of the 150th anniversary of Confederation in 2017. I have to say I am in full agreement. This isn't about Justin Trudeau at all, though I believe his family deserves to live in an asbestos free home. This is about creating something worthy of our highest office and the important dealings that could be held there.     And hey, if they abolish the Senate and put the money into the new house, this thing could pay for itself in the next decade. " will have the same chance of abolishing the Senate as Stephen Harper did. Zero, zilch, nada! "

A girl can dream.

Mela said "    SJK said "    Mela said "The CBC printed a pretty cool article written with their interview of Maureen McTeer, wife of former PM Joe Clark who's opinion is that 24 Sussex should be torn down and replaced with something Canadians can be proud of.     http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/24-sussex-drive-should-be-torn-down-1.3292650     She says the building has little historic significance since the only thing remaining from the original home is a chandelier or something like that and the renovation in the 50's was pretty much all inclusive. However the renovations would be so extensive and for what? To save a building that wasn't even built for the purpose it holds.     The best part of the interview is where she suggests that Canada should involve its top designers and engineers and architects to create something the country can form pride around and that it should be done ahead of the 150th anniversary of Confederation in 2017. I have to say I am in full agreement. This isn't about Justin Trudeau at all, though I believe his family deserves to live in an asbestos free home. This is about creating something worthy of our highest office and the important dealings that could be held there.     And hey, if they abolish the Senate and put the money into the new house, this thing could pay for itself in the next decade. " will have the same chance of abolishing the Senate as Stephen Harper did. Zero, zilch, nada! " A girl can dream. "

but I would rather see an elected senate.

Isnt very much considering the conservatives paid $25mil in attack ads alone for the election at least the money will be used for something that is needed  

memo99 said "Isnt very much considering the conservatives paid $25mil in attack ads alone for the election at least the money will be used for something that is needed   "

I think it will cost more than $10 million once they get in and find the damage. The auditor general, Sheila Fraser estimated 2008 cost to be $10 million. Harper wouldn't move out for the summer for the work to be done and now it will probably cost more.  
 
If it cost more? It does. We have a building to restore for the country. I think Maureen McTeer is wrong. The exterior of the building is more than enough to warrant a historical label.  
 

doubt the renos would of only taken a summer. It would take much longer. Seeing how no major work has taken place since the 50's, there's likely many hidden issues that will be discovered once they start. And that $10 million will balloon. Once you start needing to replace HVAC, electrical, pumbing, improving security measures and the list goes on.  
 
I think if they are going to continue to use it as the Prime Ministers residence, do the entire house inside and out. And do it properly, even if it takes a year or so. This goes beyond an individual Prime Minister.  
 
And now, do you modernize the interior to 2015 style or return it to the 1868 style interior in a modern way? From what I understand, it's currently a 50's style interior with some updates. The only thing original would be main structure and the exterior stone work.  
 
But I would also hope that they look reno cost vs. new cost. Also if it requires extensive work too the point where most of the original structure need to be replaced. For a Prime Ministers residence is 34 rooms needed?  
 
As for attack ads the Liberals will more than likely do the same thing in 4 years.  
 
Edited by Trevor B, 2015-10-29 17:18:10

when looking at the other official residences (shown in this link) 24 Sussex is the most modest of the lot. 10 Downing street has 100 rooms and I would guess it to be the second modest official residence.  
 
 
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/24-sussex-photos-world-leader-homes-1.3294982

24 Sussex is a stunning property, but that 10 million was estimated the better part of a decade ago and that was just to bring it up to livable standards. I don't think that figure would touch the kind of remodel needed today. And frankly, I think the Canadian people should be willing to incur the cost. 24 Sussex barely registers compared to what many nations have their heads of state living in. Any amount we spend now will continue to be a modest investment.

likely larger homes in Brandon than 24 Sussex and aren't considered mansions. By 1868 standards, it was a big mansion.

If 24 Sussex is to be renovated for the sole use as a residence and not a place of diplomatic reception it should be scrapped and replaced with a more modest 5-8 million dollar shack at it's current location. It's proximity to Rideau hall is important. Nonetheless, 10 million to renovate a 34 room home for the prime minister is peanuts compared to the renovation ambitions ahead and on going for the federal government.  
The renovation of centre block is estimated to cost 3 billion dollars over 20 years. http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/public-works-gears-up-for-massive-centre-block-renovation-project  
 
Renovating a train station to act as the temporary home of the red chamber, senate, is at 219 million dollars with an additional 24.5 in office rentals on account of senators refusal to walk an extra block. http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/renovation-of-senate-s-temporary-home-29m-over-budget-1.3135855  
Not all that infrastructure rhetoric spewed out by current and future governments is for provincial and municipal development. It's their own self serving crap, oh excuse me, I meant national legacy.  

Trevor B said "likely larger homes in Brandon than 24 Sussex and aren't considered mansions. By 1868 standards, it was a big mansion. "

The pictures are deceptive. I believe it's something like 12,000 square feet. That's a mansion to me.

is also what happens when you don't renovate for many years, costs go up. For places like the Parliament buildings, residences and other government buildings, they should have regular smaller renovations to keep the buildings in a up to date condition and structurally sound.

I would sure like to know how 10 million is going to be spent, I'm fairly rehearsed with construction costs, and it just doesn't add up. A small 30,000 sqft hotel, of course with sprinkler system, could be built for 10 million.  
 
If it's going to cost that much to restore, then just demolish and build something that reflects 2015.

Enfyre said "I would sure like to know how 10 million is going to be spent, I'm fairly rehearsed with construction costs, and it just doesn't add up. A small 30,000 sqft hotel, of course with sprinkler system, could be built for 10 million.     If it's going to cost that much to restore, then just demolish and build something that reflects 2015. "

Do we really want our PM's residence to look like a 2015 hotel? Our official version of the White House should reflect a nation's pride. Check the pictures here, where it's shown like a real estate ad.  
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/11/25/24-sussex-drive-value-photos_n_4338405.html

just_thinkin said "    Enfyre said "I would sure like to know how 10 million is going to be spent, I'm fairly rehearsed with construction costs, and it just doesn't add up. A small 30,000 sqft hotel, of course with sprinkler system, could be built for 10 million.     If it's going to cost that much to restore, then just demolish and build something that reflects 2015. " Do we really want our PM's residence to look like a 2015 hotel? Our official version of the White House should reflect a nation's pride. Check the pictures here, where it's shown like a real estate ad.     http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/11/25/24-sussex-drive-value-photos_n_4338405.html "

I completely agree, it should reflect a nations pride, I just used the hotel as an example for price comparison.  
 
No prime minister even lived in 24 Sussex prior to 1950something, so there is very little history or sentiment to the old place as far as an official residence.  
 
It should reflect the national pride of a modern advanced country that Canada is. It would be great to see a residence that Canada's best architects and engineers can design in the styles of the 21st Century, and 10 million dollars gives a lot of options.

The residence is a designated Canadian Heritage Property that is maintained by and the responsibility lies with the NCC (National Capital Commission).  
 
The home is partially for use in general by the PM and family of the day with living quarters and the rest of the home is intended for international and diplomatic functions hosted by our country.  
 
The NCC has not properly briefed Trudeau as yet on it's plans for the residence, which has dangerously overloaded and outdated electric - a potential fire hazard, mould, windows that need plastic to prevent drafts, a huge heating bill...on and on.  
 
Former PM's and people in the know are coming forward stating the place is a dump of a hazard and has been for years.  
 
The issue with a Heritage designated property is it must be completed in a very specific way to preserve the old, while keeping things up to code. It demands more than the average Reno and is there's a lot of criteria to be met for Heritage Designation.  
 
The NCC warned Harper several years ago it was dangerously outdated and in dire need of updating. Because he refused to move out, it's now costing Canadians much more, the longer it sits.  
 
I'm not sure about anyone else, but I would not move my young family into a firetrap, drafty, mouldy, 1868 (1950 Reno) home that is unsafe and is dangerously not up to code to today's standards. One previous PM said the bedrooms needed an electric heater to stay warm. When a heater was plugged in, the circuits would overload.  
 
Let the NCC brief the Government on what their plans are for the home first.  
 
If it was a case of a PM not quite caring for the the decor (thanks, Mulroneys), I'd be peeved.  
 
When it comes down to a potential firetrap and an unreal cost for heating (which we pay for - did I read almost $70,000 per year?), then I agree it needs to be updated to an efficient and official residence to be proud of...not embarrassing for international functions.  

We could build a new PM official residence that could be a unique and a source of pride to Canadians, but then the cons would start complaining about the cost of Justin's new mansion. Let's just re-do the existing building before it costs $100million to repair.

Utility costs kept climbing for 24 Sussex. This article from 2013.  
 
I think it's now or never.  
 
http://o.canada.com/news/24-sussex-renovations-energy-costs