Discussions

Isn't it amazing that Brandon's prices are $117.9 compared with Winnipeg starting at $103.9 and Regina the same. And the people say we are not being gouged.

Pretty typical behaviour from Brandon gas businesses. They seem to want to milk it as long as they can, despite all of the drops in the cost of fuel outside of the city.  
 
Who wants to stand with me and call out this price gouging by local gas bars?

Kirmit said "Pretty typical behaviour from Brandon gas businesses. They seem to want to milk it as long as they can, despite all of the drops in the cost of fuel outside of the city.     Who wants to stand with me and call out this price gouging by local gas bars? "

...lets call them out!  
 
.......... .. . . .  
 
Now what?  
 
Don't like the price of gas?  
 
Don't buy it.  
 
Marpet

Can’t afford the price of healthy food? Then don’t eat it!!!  
 
Don’t like the ridiculous price of housing or rent? Buy a used tent and pitch it by the river!!!  
 
Don’t like air pollution? Don’t breath it!!!  
 
Don’t like continued government scandal, waste and corruption? Don’t work (then you won’t be obligated to pay taxes).  
 
Arguments that try to suggest “don’t buy gas if you don’t like the scandalous price” as a response to citizens wanting to stand up for themselves, and not wanting to continually get scammed at the pump by local merchants, is about as intuitive as most of the other arguments that these kinds of people come up with. They are so simplistic and irrational in thought, that they confound the mind. Kinda like suggesting that if the people of Brandon don’t like the excessive price of gas at the pump means that all people from this area should drive a 400 km round trip to fill up in Winnipeg. On some level, our local gas bar merchants need to be held accountable to provide fair gas rates to the people of this community.  
 
The only thing that has been asked in this discussion from the posters is FAIRNESS in the price of gas they pay at the pump, and especially when we continually see such large regional discrepancies in these prices, year after year. At some point, the people of Brandon deserve much better.  
 
Edited by Kirmit, 2017-11-17 02:12:42

Marpet said "    Kirmit said "Pretty typical behaviour from Brandon gas businesses. They seem to want to milk it as long as they can, despite all of the drops in the cost of fuel outside of the city.     Who wants to stand with me and call out this price gouging by local gas bars? " ...lets call them out!     .......... .. . . .     Now what?     Don't like the price of gas?     Don't buy it.     Marpet "

Not sure who you are Marpet, but maybe you are a gas bar owner. Or maybe you are someone with a large bank account and don’t mind paying the difference.  
 
But maybe the posters noticing the large discrepancies in the price of gas means it costs more to shuttle their kid between home, school and daycare. Maybe for certain people, the difference in the price of gas could help a single parent put food on their child’s table, or clothes on their back. Maybe the difference in the price of gas means last months rent gets paid, or that a few Christmas gifts make around the tree, or that a parent elects to buy medicine whose price seems just out of reach.  
 
Joining a conversation in a way that completely misses the point of what is being discussed in many ways is unthoughtful to the rest. Life, for some, is complicated, and asking for price fairness on fuel (which is an essential item in most peoples lives) should be given some careful thought and consideration. Should a single parent who is trying to shuttle kids around the city, to schools, hospitals, grocery stores, etc. be expected not to buy gas and walk to all of these places in the dead of winter? Should they be forced to take the bus 2 hours round trip to take the kids to daycare, then bus off to work, and then do the reverse at the end of each day? And by your logic, would the bus fare not be affected by the increased cost for this fuel?  
 
The people of Brandon have every right to question the rates of gas they pay at the pump. To say otherwise really misses the mark in what is trying to be discussed. A fair pump price on what amounts to be an essential good for maintaining a stable life in this society is not a luxury, nor is it too much to ask.  
 
Edited by Kirmit, 2017-11-17 02:42:21

This has been going on for decades I can Remember back in the 80s when Bill Turner had Talk Back on Q Country, he started every show by saying no calls on the price of gas please, we will do a broadcast on gas and hopefully get somebody that's in the know on, and almost every show first or second call or soon there after was the call, hey whats up with Brandon gas prices it was so bad sometimes, he had to just hang up on people, then the angry calls why don't you want to talk about gas prices.And I don't think he ever had anybody in that could explain it, but I might have missed it  
 
Iv'e known a few in the gas business corporate stations franchises and they all say the same thing head office sets the price and I've been told by some that when they didn't do it they usually got a call from head office right away because another station complained and called it in, is that true, I cant say maybe they just use that as a cover story, but its been higher than the city for 40 years and never been an explanation that I can remember.  
 
What can be done its a real head scratches only thing that I can think of is if people started bombarding company head offices with phone calls Emails and letters we might make enough noise for at least an explanation.

Thing why hasn't any news agency,the Brandon Sun for instance, had a reporter investigate this, an expose on gas prices, seeing its been going on for years and people defiantly want to know, Id buy a paper to find out but I guess they could care less about news that might affect an advertiser if something shady was happening.

Remember in the 80's when you'd go to Winnipeg once a year? I lived in a small town and we'd come to Brandon once or twice a year because we couldn't afford gas to come much more than that. Now people live in Killarney and drive to and from Brandon every year.  
 
I agree with Marpet, you all should. You don't like the price then move to Brandon, or get a smaller SUV or car, maybe walk somewhere. If you're driving so much that 7 cents per litre is driving you to bankruptcy then scale your life down 7 cents a litre. What's that work out to? $7/week on a 100 litre tank?  
 
In case you haven't noticed that's a BRANDON thing. Housing here is more expensive and the rent is insane. Taxes are crazy. I can buy OR rent a nicer house for less in Winnipeg...why should gas be singled out? Buying a car...head into Winnipeg let me know if it's more or less than here.  
 
Gasoline isn't a right. You are not owed cheap travel.

Live in Killarney and drive to work every day...

everyone wants no more pipelines built. Every time a pipeline is shut down the price of gas goes up. With the pipeline leak in South Dakota there will be people that want bit shut down. Pipelines are like the plumbing in your house, it is not if it will leak it is when. You don't tear the plumbing out of your house because it leaked, you fix and continue to use it. The only safe way to transport oil is pipelines and until we quit driving cars and heating our houses we need them. any eco warrior that doesn't use oil or products made with oil can step forward, the line would be empty.

We were in Winnipeg and filled up Sunday. It was 117 then. When did it come down? Because you do realize there's a 24-48 hour lag with Brandon gas prices vs. Winnipeg usually, going up or down.  
 
In fact, gas has been within a cent of Winnipeg pretty much everytime we've gone in all fall. If anywhere is going to be sustantially cheaper it will be Portage lately. By the time you hit Whitehorse or cetainly Headingly, its peaked back up.  
 
Also, Winnipeg gas prices are not consistent. It can vary as much as 5-10 cents across the city, mostly due to sheer size. So its not always fair to declare "Winnipeg is this" because you're looking at peak/bottom numbers. Brandon has oretty consistent gas prices because we're small. Its like comparing average housing prices, you really can't. Winnipeg's prices are lowered by their whole north end ghetto where you can pick up a house for cheap. But to compare apples to apples its roughly the same to at least buy there vs. Brandon.

Kirmit said "Pretty typical behaviour from Brandon gas businesses. They seem to want to milk it as long as they can, despite all of the drops in the cost of fuel outside of the city.     Who wants to stand with me and call out this price gouging by local gas bars? "

Boycotting does work!!!  
Only buy from one Station...boycott all of he rest!!!

Can’t afford the price of healthy food? Then don’t eat it!!! Grow it!!!  
 
Don’t like the ridiculous price of housing or rent? Buy a used tent and pitch it by the river!!! Works for one guy  
 
Don’t like air pollution? Don’t breath it!!!  
Well. If you don't buy gas, there will be less pollution  
 
Don’t like continued government scandal, waste and corruption? Don’t work (then you won’t be obligated to pay taxes). ...or vote!  
 
"scandalous price"? A couple years ago we were paying almost $1.30 a litre. Same comments, same complaints, same solution.  
 
You said - "But maybe the posters noticing the large discrepancies in the price of gas means it costs more to shuttle their kid between home, school and daycare. Maybe for certain people, the difference in the price of gas could help a single parent put food on their child’s table, or clothes on their back. Maybe the difference in the price of gas means last months rent gets paid, or that a few Christmas gifts make around the tree, or that a parent elects to buy medicine whose price seems just out of reach."  
 
Everyone's situation is different and I can't speak for the members of our society that are really feeling the pinch of these higher prices but for the vast majority of us in Brandon.....what the hell are you complaining about? You have a job, a roof over your head and apparently...a car! If you cant make it work, you have 2 choices:  
 
1. Earn more.  
 
2. Spend less.  
 
That's it.  
 
I have been fortunate to travel to many different places in my life and I get so sick and tired of these posts about how bad we have it because we pay 5 cents more than Winnipeg?  
 
Give me a break. Do yourself a favour and take a look at Eastern Europe, Northern Africa, or the Middle East, then come back on here and whine about your 5 cents. How would you like to be living in Haiti or Puerto Rico right now? Now, those are countries where their citizens are in real dire straits.  
 
The oil and gas industry are a free market entity and to my knowledge (correct me if I'm wrong), the local gas merchants do not set the price. The price is at a level that the industry believes the market can handle...and the market is about making a profit. If you really believe that boycotting a gas station will make any difference on the market, knock yourself out but you'll still pay $1.17/litre.  
 
The simple fact is, we are addicted to the conveniences that we enjoy in our lives and we don't want to have to choose between what we need and what we want.  
 
Is the price of gas high in Brandon? Yes, but what are you going to do? Buy it or don't.  
 
And no, I don't own any business in town nor do I have a bank account full of money. I am however, part of a 2 income family with respectable middle class incomes. That doesn't preclude me from making poor financial choices and overspending. If I find I have to choose between gas and groceries...I'll walk to the grocery store to buy my overpriced organic apples.  
 
...but that's another thread.  
 
Marpet

That some people just don't understand price fairness. They come up with any excuse for the price difference, and they are fine with it.  
 
It is not about having a more economical vehicle, or driving less, or walking, or taking the bus, etc. It is about the price discrepancy. Brandon is being gouged and some of us don't like paying the big difference in price. We are "fine" paying what ever the price is, as long as it is comparable to other areas, like Austin and Winnipeg.  
 
The competition bureau doesn't care because it means more taxes for the governments, which is run by the government. Some people would call that a conflict of interest.

It''s a funny thing that some people want to suggest that it''s the FREE market that sets the price. I don''t know what your idea on FREE market is, and maybe that''s worth some words, but what I can tell you is that during the first half of 2014, when a barrel of crude oil was trading to record levels of over $100 per barrel, the price at the pump was about $1.25 per litre, maybe $1.30 at most. Then the price per barrel collapse happened, and the price at the pump has never reflected what "FREE market" principles should. The fact of the matter is, that the price of a barrel of oil does not matter when you live in a society where governments allow rigged energy prices. What is the price of a barrel of gas now ($50 - $55)? Why doesn''t the price at the pump reflect that? Why is it some lame excuse that they are having refining problems and that drives the price up 20% each month (where it never seems to come down without complaints)? Why is it that when, a few short years ago, when the price of a barrel of oil was over $100 we pay nearly the same amount at the pump as the price of a barrel of oil now ($50)? I will tell you why. It''s because your FREE market is RIGGED!!! The oil and gas companies own us!!! There is no thing as a FREE MARKET!!! It''s a RIGGED MARKET, just like your elections (here people, is your democratic choice between two or three people). I can''t stand it when people try to suggest that the FREE market is responsible for this, because I think if people really thought about it, you are going to be paying an amount on fuel that pushes the boundaries of what will be approved on your credit card, whether the "free market" is working or not. I would love for someone to step up and explain the "free market" to the rest of us, when all we see is a rigged market these days. For the young people out there, this isn''t how it used to be. There used to be real competition in the marketplace and it wasn''t rigged this bad, so if you are still trying to figure out how to move out of your parents house and you are pushing 30, it''s NOT you, it''s us!!! That''s why you can''t afford an apartment, a tent, or a camping spot next to the river. And you just got the raw end of the stick when a rigged economy came roaring through here the last 15 years, and when governments decided they would look after the big corporations with money, instead of the taxpaying sucker trying to build a life. Those are my thoughts. Anyone?  
 
One interesting thing that should make everybody''s blood boil, is that the completely broken system of government is so blatantly obvious. Instead of regulating your fuel prices or things that are important to your pocketbook, the Competition Bureau is heavily involved focusing their energies on street food trucks:  
 
https://globalnews.ca/news/3606149/canadian-cities-food-truck/  
 
What does that tell you about their priorities, or where powers of enforcing competition in this country rest!?!  
 
FOOD TRUCKS!!!  
 
They are telling people trying to make a living selling french fries out of a truck that they are in violation of competition rules, when the banks, the oil and gas companies now have everyone distracted enough to be able to walk away with the majority of your money.  
 
Edited by JoeSixpack, 2017-11-17 11:45:59

I did a little research....a VERY little. I went to gasbuddy.com and discovered that as you get further from the Canadian coast line, the price of gas drops. So, if you want to say that we’re getting gouged here in Brandon, I suggest you take a trip to Vancouver or Montreal where prices range from $1.30/L in Montreal to $1.39/L in Vancouver.

The price of gas in British Columbia and Quebec are completely skewed from the national average. In those provinces in particular the price is because of long standing and high rate of provincial taxes on gasoline and fuels, that drive their market prices up. Your observation has nothing to do with where you live (i.e. distance from the coast). If anything, Canadian gas companies are trying to get their (unrefined) products TO THE COAST.  
 
The debate here is about why, in the Province of Manitoba with the same tax rate, the price of gas at the pump is always significantly more for the people of Brandon than for the people living outside of this city, including Winnipeg.  
 
Edited by JoeSixpack, 2017-11-17 11:57:58

Explain the average cost of $119.9 in Lethbridge, $122 in Medicine Hat and $121.9 in Grand Prairie Alberta? Fuel prices are higher in Alberta than they are in Brandon right now, and their fuel tax and PST are both lower

Is currently the cheapest place in Canada to buy fuel. On average, Manitoba has the lowest prices in the nation, followed by Saskatchewan, then Alberta and the rest of Canada is all north of $120 per litre

PrimeConvoy said "Explain the average cost of $119.9 in Lethbridge, $122 in Medicine Hat and $121.9 in Grand Prairie Alberta? Fuel prices are higher in Alberta than they are in Brandon right now, and their fuel tax and PST are both lower "

Part of it has to do with a provincial carbon tax that was imposed on Alberta effective Jan 1, 2017.  
 
http://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/heres-how-albertas-carbon-tax-works-and-how-it-will-affect-your-wallet  
 
You shouldn't necessarily be comparing prices BETWEEN PROVINCES because different Provincially imposed taxes affect these prices.  
 
In Manitoba, the taxes are the same. They are all PROVINCIAL taxes and Brandon and Portage and Winnipeg are the same. This discussion focuses on why Brandon prices are always so much higher.

...what you’re saying is that the oil companies have nothing to do with the price...it all boils down to taxes? And that would be why Manitoba pays less than almost anyone for fuel??

PrimeConvoy said "Explain the average cost of $119.9 in Lethbridge, $122 in Medicine Hat and $121.9 in Grand Prairie Alberta? Fuel prices are higher in Alberta than they are in Brandon right now, and their fuel tax and PST are both lower "

There is about 9.5 hours driving time difference between Grande Prairie and Medicine Hat, yet the price is the same. Winnipeg and Brandon are two hours apart, but there is a 7 - 10 cent a litre difference between the two.  
 
Most of us know that it is gouging. Some of you don't see it that way. Come on then, explain this one (with VALID arguments)!

Really? That''s what you got from this information?  
 
Maybe I should be moving on from this conversation.  
 
PS: The discussion is about a comparison between gas prices within the province of Manitoba, and there are other factors (like tax) that also affect the price of fuel between each of the provinces.  
 
The price discrepancy between Brandon and any other place within Manitoba HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH TAXES. We all come from the same province, and so are subject to the same provincially imposed rates.  
 
Edited by JoeSixpack, 2017-11-17 13:39:20

JoeSixpack said "    PrimeConvoy said "Explain the average cost of $119.9 in Lethbridge, $122 in Medicine Hat and $121.9 in Grand Prairie Alberta? Fuel prices are higher in Alberta than they are in Brandon right now, and their fuel tax and PST are both lower " Part of it has to do with a provincial carbon tax that was imposed on Alberta effective Jan 1, 2017.     http://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/heres-how-albertas-carbon-tax-works-and-how-it-will-affect-your-wallet     You shouldn't necessarily be comparing prices BETWEEN PROVINCES because different Provincially imposed taxes affect these prices.     In Manitoba, the taxes are the same. They are all PROVINCIAL taxes and Brandon and Portage and Winnipeg are the same. This discussion focuses on why Brandon prices are always so much higher. "

...the market can bear it.  
 
There is no law that states if the price of a barrel drops by half then gas prices must follow.  
Oil and gas companies are out to make money. As long as we are willing to continue to buy at ever increasing prices then the prices will naturally stay high...and we will keep buying it.  
 
How many industries have moved overseas to manufacture their products? Does that guarantee lower prices? No.  
Cell phones, clothes, shoes, automobile parts, etc all being made at cheaper costs to the manufacturer but the prices continue to rise. Why? Because were are willing to pay for it no matter the cost.  
$1000 for an IPhone X and the lines will be around the block but were pissed about 5 cents at the pump.  
 
It costs more here because the usage doesn't drop when the price goes up. In WPG you have a market of 800,000 people so there is competition for your dollar and everyone still survives. Here, 58000 people plus surrounding neighbours. Not enough population to create effective competition so the prices are the same and set at what the market will bear without being too far off the provincial average. Even if it was significantly higher, people would still pay.  
 
Marpet

Marpet said "    JoeSixpack said "    PrimeConvoy said "Explain the average cost of $119.9 in Lethbridge, $122 in Medicine Hat and $121.9 in Grand Prairie Alberta? Fuel prices are higher in Alberta than they are in Brandon right now, and their fuel tax and PST are both lower " Part of it has to do with a provincial carbon tax that was imposed on Alberta effective Jan 1, 2017.     http://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/heres-how-albertas-carbon-tax-works-and-how-it-will-affect-your-wallet     You shouldn't necessarily be comparing prices BETWEEN PROVINCES because different Provincially imposed taxes affect these prices.     In Manitoba, the taxes are the same. They are all PROVINCIAL taxes and Brandon and Portage and Winnipeg are the same. This discussion focuses on why Brandon prices are always so much higher. " ...the market can bear it.     There is no law that states if the price of a barrel drops by half then gas prices must follow.   Oil and gas companies are out to make money. As long as we are willing to continue to buy at ever increasing prices then the prices will naturally stay high...and we will keep buying it.     How many industries have moved overseas to manufacture their products? Does that guarantee lower prices? No.   Cell phones, clothes, shoes, automobile parts, etc all being made at cheaper costs to the manufacturer but the prices continue to rise. Why? Because were are willing to pay for it no matter the cost.   $1000 for an IPhone X and the lines will be around the block but were pissed about 5 cents at the pump.     It costs more here because the usage doesn't drop when the price goes up. In WPG you have a market of 800,000 people so there is competition for your dollar and everyone still survives. Here, 58000 people plus surrounding neighbours. Not enough population to create effective competition so the prices are the same and set at what the market will bear without being too far off the provincial average. Even if it was significantly higher, people would still pay.     Marpet "

If milk producers decided to raise the price of a jug of milk to $30, and the average price of food at the grocery store increased by 500%, you still have to eat. These are essential items needed to get through your day. Food, lodging, transportation, are all essential items. These prices need to be regulated, but they are not. The essential items in our society are being manipulated under the false premise of "free market". There is no part of this model that abides by that principle, when there is a refusal to enforce competition.  
 
Look at northern Manitoba reserves, and the outrageous food costs charged by the grocery stores to the indigenous people. That situation is sick. At some point, you need to recognise that imposing extremes of prices does not produce an economy that works. Your capitalist viewpoint that hard working, taxpaying suckers should somehow pay the price of corporate greed is sickening.  
 
Can you imagine living in a northern community, where the price for a jug of milk far exceeds the price of a can of pop. I recall seeing a 24 pack of crappy bottled water sell for $22.  
 
https://globalnews.ca/news/2934532/20-ground-beef-northern-ontario-first-nations-spend-more-than-50-of-income-on-food/  
 
https://globalnews.ca/news/2447177/new-campaign-aims-to-shed-light-on-the-high-cost-of-food-in-canadas-north/  
 
Nobody here is asking for anything beyond price fairness.  
 
Your argument that somehow Winnipeg is a larger city and has more competition is also wrong. A city will build as many gas stations as are needed to serve a given population. If winnipeg is 10 times bigger than Brandon, it will build 10 times more gas stations, but the ration between population and gas stations will generally remain the same. Brandon is large enough to support many gas stations, so there is absolutely no need for this difference. Heck, even small communities with less population compared to Brandon, have pump prices that are cheaper. There is something seriously wrong with Brandon, and the manner in which residents of this city always seem to pay more (and not in a justified way).

https://globalnews.ca/news/2447177/new-campaign-aims-to-shed-light-on-the-high-cost-of-food-in-canadas-north/

As I said... the market will bear these prices without a disruption in the services.  
 
In no way shape or form is transportation an essential service (in that it is your right to have cheap gas to drive to work. Hell, your drivers license isn't a Right, how can cheap gas be?)  
 
My point is simple and straight forward. The people of Brandon won't change their habits and will absorb the price increases in almost all services and all they will do is come on these boards and whine. 40% of Manitobans didn't vote in the last election. The apathy to these situations is staggering.  
 
If you think you'll make change by complaining on these boards...all the power to you. I hope your successful but I won't hold my breath.  
 
Marpet

Maybe this will help.  
 
http://www.larrymaguire.ca/contact  
 
Lead the way, my friend.  
 
Marpet

They do it cause they can, and yes it is apathy. When I said to look at a boycott of one company and boycott that station, I also mentioned it was not personal but business, and I got called out on that. The reply to that was it is personal because it affects people and their families. Now how be we take a look at other businesses, as JoeSixPack did. When you are out shopping and you walk past one source of protein to choose a cheaper protein you are not only boycotting a product but the producer of that product, and people and families get hurt as well, or what about any retail business that doesn't make it because they are not competative in a town, or a given trading area. Boycott is part of business, it is the way for the consumer to keep what they can in their pocket.  
I'm going to give a bit of what I consider logical thinking on the higher prices in Brandon lasting longer than maybe they should, does it involve collusion, you make your own decision. Not all retail outlets for gas get filled up at the same time, so when the price of fuel takes a big jump the retailer that paid the higher price raises his price, and others follow suit, if the price remains high for more than a few days likely most retailers will pay a higher price to restock. When the price drops, there should be a reverse scenario, meaning that the station that got the cheaper fuel would drop the price and others would once again follow suit. The result would be a cost averaging, you make a bit extra on the fuel you bought cheaper in the beginning, and you lose a bit on the expensive fuel when it drops. Or this is how it should work, without knowing the restocking rate of the retail outlet we can only speculate on whether we are being gouged or not.  
As a consumer I just hate seeing the mention of involving government at all. They do what they do because we let them. To myself, business is sort of a game, but I wish people would learn to stand up and fight back. I'm the kind of person who belives that the voice of a single individual is important and it doesn't matter if it at the local, provincial, federal, or international level. We all know that righting situations begins usually with a single voice, I don't call it bi###ing, I call it progress in addressing something that individuals find wrong.

we get gouged because we let ourselves be gouged. We are consumers, we have choices and we have buying power. If you want change you need to use that buying power efficiently. We don't need the government to come in and save us.  
you want lower gas prices, pick the company that consistently has the lowest gas prices. research loyally programs and pick a company that gives pack. Don't buy a drop from the companies that raise it first.  
You want a lower carbon footprint, start in your house first, a simple vegetarian diet will cut back your footprint more than you could with with any other changes to you life. Cut back on driving, get a efficient/electric vehicle. The point is, use your power as a consumer to make changes.  
The only way to stop price gouging is to use you buying power as a consumer.