Discussions

I'm not being rude but have a question do the First Nations have to live there? I'm just trying to understand.

No, no one HAS to live somewhere. However, that is their home. That is where their family is. They have a community up there and I think it is fair of them to expect basic necessities, such as clean drinking water and education and health care.  
I believe the government has a responsibility to care for all communities, no matter how isolated they may be.

aniqbee said "No, no one HAS to live somewhere. However, that is their home. That is where their family is. They have a community up there and I think it is fair of them to expect basic necessities, such as clean drinking water and education and health care.   I believe the government has a responsibility to care for all communities, no matter how isolated they may be. "

I totally agree .

They were moved to a man made island in order to give 3000 acres of land to Winnipeg. The government absolutely owes them a road.  
 
 
 
Edited by Mommydearest, 2015-10-06 11:04:54

Mommydearest said "They were moved to a man made island in order to give 3000 acres of land to Winnipeg. We absolutely owe them a road. "

but the "we" should be replaced with Winnipeg and the Provincial NDP owes them a road.

SJK- Changed it to government, who definitely should have done this years ago.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/shoal-lake-40-first-nation-taking-its-case-to-un-1.2595851  
 
heres a link to the story

IDK a lot about the community but i do know lack of treated drinking water happens not only on reserves, there are small towns and hamlets that are on a boil water advisory too as well as farms that run on wells, some drinkable some not so i wonder if these issues that plague the reserve system are more to do with location and population issues  
 
reserves also have different funding and municipal structures that may contribute to their issues  
 
as far as the road goes i do know of a few smaller communities serviced by ferries, its not that uncommon but if the government changed their access then they should have made a deal with the town, so what was the deal? was there ferry acceptable to the council who made the agreement? was their provisions put in place to sustain the ferry, or is this a case of not enough forethought, basically bad business  
 
honestly lots of questions to ask before we place blame but one thing to consider is that the higher level governments aren't fair to other small towns and municipalities either  
 
 

I guess I have to agree that a road should be built.  
I'm not wanting to start a debate on whether we agree on the idea of one community when we are talking of our society, but personally I do consider us one society and roads systems are a thing that we all need.  
 
On potable water and a sewage system I have mixed feelings being from a farm and having had to fund these things for myself, I do know that governments do make funding available for communities that wish to undertake such projects, at what level I'm not sure.

Rue said "    aniqbee said "No, no one HAS to live somewhere. However, that is their home. That is where their family is. They have a community up there and I think it is fair of them to expect basic necessities, such as clean drinking water and education and health care.   I believe the government has a responsibility to care for all communities, no matter how isolated they may be. " I totally agree . "

I agree. Although I will add that not all reserves like not all small towns should have all services.  
 
Small town People all over Manitoba have to travel to larger centers for things like child care centers, schools hospitals etc.  
 
I just found out this week we here in Brandon no longer have a tax office. Well I guess we do. It is conveniently located in Winnipeg.  

aniqbee said "No, no one HAS to live somewhere. However, that is their home. That is where their family is. They have a community up there and I think it is fair of them to expect basic necessities, such as clean drinking water and education and health care.   I believe the government has a responsibility to care for all communities, no matter how isolated they may be. "

that the band has received funding from the government to provide these services and the leaders have choose to spent it else were.Not all service can be provided in all locations at equal levels its not possible that is way old people chose to move to lager centers when the get older. I would also like to know from anyone in the know how much tax money would be collected from this area to help provide such service

Not all reserves misuse their funding, its pretty ignorant to just assume they have misused their funding. If you actually knew what small amount reserves get for infrastructure etc with their population its laughable.

The government hasn't completely ignored this problem. A financial agreement was put into place in 1989. It may not be enough by today's standards but was implemented more than 25 years ago.  
http://www.arch.umanitoba.ca/greenmap/pages/GrnMp_kpShoalLk/pages/3.html

fargobob said "The government hasn't completely ignored this problem. A financial agreement was put into place in 1989. It may not be enough by today's standards but was implemented more than 25 years ago.   http://www.arch.umanitoba.ca/greenmap/pages/GrnMp_kpShoalLk/pages/3.html "

so it seems they have an agreement that aloted money in trust with a portion of principle alotted over the 60 year agreement made in 89 so the agreement brings them up to 2049, the agreement was 9 mil but it should have also been earning intrest. i'm not sure how much they get every year off the trust but the deal was made weather it was a bad one or not the deal was made

StarryNight said "Not all reserves misuse their funding, its pretty ignorant to just assume they have misused their funding. If you actually knew what small amount reserves get for infrastructure etc with their population its laughable. "

what does reserve get for funding per person, per year

https://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/1100100010656/1100100010657 Here is a link to what infrastructure funding was available over a period of 9 years, but this covers all First Nations communities approximately 617. So if you do the math per year, per community it is very little. Even with extra funds available the communities need to have project plans in place before they get additional funding, which cost extra money to hire engineers etc. These additional cost sometimes need to be paid out of revenue which many First Nations do not have.

StarryNight said "https://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/1100100010656/1100100010657 Here is a link to what infrastructure funding was available over a period of 9 years, but this covers all First Nations communities approximately 617. So if you do the math per year, per community it is very little. Even with extra funds available the communities need to have project plans in place before they get additional funding, which cost extra money to hire engineers etc. These additional cost sometimes need to be paid out of revenue which many First Nations do not have. "

not having a tax base to draw off of does hinder reserves and is an issue, other towns get transfers and o wonder how much do other small towns get in transfers to pay their infrastructure but the difference is the residents pay the extra through taxes

received funding on a provincial and federal level based on individual tax's paid to the government, I wonder how much funding would be allocated.  
 
Edited by Jaxon, 2015-10-09 13:09:28

One thing I have noticed is the lot spacing between homes. I have looked on google maps and seen how far apart the homes are. The costing to run that much piping and upkeep cannot be cheap. I had to look at one reserve recently and there are miles of water/sewer that are needed to service a few homes. Just down the road in a small town in less than a mile all homes were serviced. I don't understand why they don't develop closer together. It would probably save a lot of money.

Fishin Guy said "One thing I have noticed is the lot spacing between homes. I have looked on google maps and seen how far apart the homes are. The costing to run that much piping and upkeep cannot be cheap. I had to look at one reserve recently and there are miles of water/sewer that are needed to service a few homes. Just down the road in a small town in less than a mile all homes were serviced. I don't understand why they don't develop closer together. It would probably save a lot of money. "

But many reserves have water and septic tanks for each home with a water truck that makes weekly runs to fill them from their own water treatment plants.

Tamara79 said "    Fishin Guy said "One thing I have noticed is the lot spacing between homes. I have looked on google maps and seen how far apart the homes are. The costing to run that much piping and upkeep cannot be cheap. I had to look at one reserve recently and there are miles of water/sewer that are needed to service a few homes. Just down the road in a small town in less than a mile all homes were serviced. I don't understand why they don't develop closer together. It would probably save a lot of money. " But many reserves have water and septic tanks for each home with a water truck that makes weekly runs to fill them from their own water treatment plants. "

i wonder if they have to follow the same rules as we do about septic fields, that would explain the distance apart the houses are but who should pay for the service is debatable, like don said farmers and acreage owners have to pay for their own well or cistern filling as well as maintain their own septic system while if you live in town with enough people to cover water treatment then those conveniences are available but you do get a water bill and taxes pay the rest, im not sure how many live on this reserve or others but it seems to me that services should be the same as any other population with the same size range but then again these reserves are their own nations i thought so it is up to them how they use their funds, if they are not making their constituents happy then it is up to them to vote for change isnt it?

They had their chance at a water treatment plant but they didnt want to share it with shoal lake 39. A treatment plant for just 150 ppl is a waste of govt money. In 1989 the city of wpg gave shoal lake 40 a trust of 6 million dollars. Why didnt they build one with that money. Or drill multiple wells for water distribution. Two sides to every story.